(I have already posted this on the CWI board and it was suggested that I also post this here for some of you to read...apologies for it being so long. Please take my adivce and dont do it, too many hearts get broken).

Hello everyone, I'll try to keep this longwinded and ramble free as possible. Please bare with me.

Firstly please, can I just say this. If there is anyone, anyone out there male or female, tempted into considering an affair for whatever reason...for god's sake, please DON'T do it. My husband and I are in one big sorry mess because of our actions and the heartache for both of us, is crippling.

I've come onto this board, looking for a friendly ear and hopefully a bit of advice. We're both struggling to cope with this overwhelming mountain we have to climb, and there are days when it feels so dark and useless, neither of us knows what to do.  I hope you will read this without being judgemental and hopefully I can explain our situation from both points of view.

So a bit of background first. We are married and have been for four years, not long you may say but before we got married, we lived together for 8. So I would say, we've been together getting on for 12, 13 years now. I'm quite a bit younger than my husband, by 10 years and this is the first time I've been married. Its the second time round for my husband, he also has two boys who are now grown up and have lives of their own. When we got together, I was 25, he was 35. He got married to his first wife when they were both very young and over the years they drifted apart emotionally and physically only to stay together for the two boys. When he and I met each other, their marriage was all but over and he and I felt as if we'd found our soulmate. By mutual decision, he and his first wife got divorced and we soon got together. Happy, very much in love, neither of us daring to believe we'd found the one. We had lots of fun. The first few years were spent going out, socialising, making new friends with other couples, going on amazing holidays and generally just having a fun, carefree wonderful life. As the years went on, we moved up the social ladder. We bought a bigger place, had good jobs to bring home a decent income, stayed very loyal to our inner circle of close friends and got a dog!

It wasn't completely without its problems long the way though. Throughout the whole of our relationship, marriage included, there was a woman who would stalk my husband continuously. Unfortunately, he made the mistake, before I came along, of having a couple of one night stands with her. From that moment on, she became obsessed with him. Totally believing that they were meant to be together. She would also stalk me, follow me to work, follow me around the town, in the hope, I think, that I would lead her to my husband, wherever he may be that day. I knew of her. She was no secret in our relationship. I knew she would hassle him, try to talk to him, wave at him, smile at him, you name it, whenever either he on his own or when we were both out together. She would do her upmost to get to him not caring who she hurt in the process. It was just something we had no other choice in but to live with. 

Apart from that,  we had everything you could possibly want and people would comment and say how lucky we were and we knew that, but for me there was starting to be something missing. I was getting more than a little fedup with bunny boiler and her little stories and also I was edging my way upto being 30 years old. I wanted us to have a family. It was something that was discussed from time to time but it was a difficult conversation. My husband, already having had two boys that were by now in their teens didn't really want to have anymore children. He felt he had done his bit with the nappy changing and night time feeding years ago but that sadly didn't really help me with my situation and my age being what it was. We talked about it several times over the space of a few years in the hope that I could change his mind but it would always end in an argument. We both tend to have fiery tempers, nasty things would often get said in the heat of the moment and damage to our relationship, which we considered to be so strong, was being done. In the end, I realised and accepted that it was pointless in trying to persuade him otherwise. Also I reasoned with myself that it was no more fairer to twist his arm over something as it was for him to twist mine. This was something where compromise didn't really exist and one of us had to give in. I thought about it, tried to balance it against the lifestyle we had and decided to accept that it wasn't going to happen.

After a while, I became resentful. Our relationship started to change, it started to break down. We were becoming impatient with each other, bickering and sniping at each other, just sheer nastiness. We had taken what we had for granted and we were no longer grateful for each other. The rows became worse and the resentment towards each other was worser still. After one particularly bad spell of rows, completely unacceptable things got said and I realised I couldn't go on anymore. I felt there was no love left in our relationship and I'd lost all faith in him and our marriage. I didn't put any plan into action. I didn't even have a plan but I did know that not before long, I would be moving out.

Shortly after, a few weeks, I was in the local pub and I happened to see a bunch of young lads, one of which I thought looked very familiar. After looking closer I realised that he was the son of my first serious boyfriend from way back when I was in school. I was surprised at how much he looked like his dad and I offered a friendly hello and asked him how his father was, as it was about 20 years since I'd last seen him. As general chit chat occurred, his dad happened to call his son on his mobile and after about 20 seconds of them talking to each other, his son gave the phone to me and told me his dad was on the other end wanting to say hello. As awkward as it was, I politely spoke to him, talking about the usual, what we were upto, where we were living etc etc. As we got talking, memories of him came flooding back and back to a time when life seemed easier, with no pressures of life or any bills to pay. We chatted for about 10 minutes, until he had to go and do something else and he asked me if I would text my number through on his son's phone, so that he could talk to me later when he wasn't so busy. Ok I said, I'll do it later. I really had no intention of doing it at all. I was just saying that so I didn't offend him. That's the sort of person I am unfortunately. I hate to offend anyone and sometimes, end up in trouble for it along the way.  A couple of hours later, his son came up to me and said his dad had been on the phone again and asked was I going to send my number through.. I wasn't going to but, not making any excuses here, I'd had a few drinks by then, I was still sore from the horrible row with my husband. I was flattered that someone wanted my number so much as to ask for it again and I was vulnerable and extremely open to anything that would make me feel worthwhile. So I sent it through and sadly most regrettably, that was the start of it. After a weekend of texting, light flirting but nothing more, I told him I was married. I also told him I was unhappily married and that things were not working out the way I had hoped. He asked if I wanted to meet for a coffee later in the week, I said I'd let him know, trying to give myself time to sort myself out but by the end of the week, I was either pathetic and weak or we'd had another row at home for whatever reason and I gave in and decided to meet up for coffee. I knew there was great risk in doing this. We were childhood sweethearts at school and I could quite clearly remember the butterflies you felt at that age and wondered how it would feel meeting him again. But even knowing this, I still agreed to meet. We met up and went for coffee, nothing else. We mainly talked about our lives, where we were at and what was going on at that time. I told him about the children situation for me. He listened, told me there's more to life to just having kids, I agreed. For some people there is. But I'd done all I wanted to do and I didn't want to go through life and not have them. Time was running out for me... After we had coffee I drove home feeling like I'd been listened to and sympathised with. It didn't help with the situation back home, it only served to put more distance between me and the problems I faced, making me feel more isolated and more discontent. After that night, almost a week after texting on the phone we would meet regularly for coffee and we would just talk. I have to admit by this stage I was starting fall under his spell. He still had the boyish cocky charm he had when at school and to be honest, I was starting to feel like a teenager again. Classic cliche and I fell for it, hook line and sinker. After a couple of weeks I'd found that I'd completely emotionally detached myself from my home and my husband and that moving out was the only option I had. One night came and I was miserable. I was feeling ill with stress, I felt unhappy and I felt like vanishing into thin air. The one and only time that the boy's father went for a drink with his son at mine and my husbands local pub was the night I drank myself stupid. I couldn't cope with the situation I was in any longer, I felt total sadness for me and my husband, thinking there was no way we could ever regain what we once had, my judgement had been clouded by the shoulder that was leant to me by the boys father and I wanted to just disappear. So in true eastenders style, I lashed all of my hurt and despair onto my husband while standing outside the pub, him waiting to take me home, infront of all our friends, for everyone to see.  In my head it went dark. If felt like someone had literally turned the lights out.

I moved out. After the performance I gave the night before I felt I'd gone too far to go back on it. How could I possible explain away what was behind the horrible things I said to him in front of everyone? I could put it down to drink but I was way past that, I don't think either of us would have believed it.  I had to continue forward. I started so I will finish was my minds thinking. My husband was destroyed. My god. I killed him that day. I'll never forgive myself for that for as long as I live. I don't know what happened. I'd gone cold. In the space of two to three weeks, I'd turned into this coldhearted, brainwashed bitch. I just felt absolutely nothing. I could see the pain he was in but I still forged ahead like some sort of zombie. I don't know what the hell I thought I was doing. But I left and I left my husband in tatters. I spent a month drifting about, staying here and there. I stayed at a friends house, stayed with my mum a while, stayed with my sister a few nights all the while believing I had done the right thing. Knowing that one day the pain would go away but all I needed now was to be somewhere I felt safe. I didn't know where that was, I just thought whatever will be, will be. Let fate decide. During this time we were still meeting up for coffee and to just sit and talk. Gradually and bit by bit it became more sexual although this wasn't the main attraction, it wasn't the draw as the sex didn't happen very often. In our chats he would tell me about his unhappy situation and how he wanted a fresh start. We started to talk about setting up a place somewhere, he said that with our wages together we could live comfortably. For obvious reasons I thought the further away I was the better for everyone. So we looked around and found a place, a good 40 mile or so away and with 4 to 5 weeks of me leaving...we moved in together. It was strange. Its a very odd feeling, living with someone who you're are not used to and not familiar with. Infact it doesn't feel very nice at all. All the time, you are making comparisons in your head but you tell yourself that its normal, its what anyone else would do and you carry on with it. There are some things that are acceptable and there are some things that aren't, you just learn to live with it. To start with it felt like a holiday. I felt like I was on an extended holiday, away from my troubles and problems, just that the holiday went on and on and on and after a while the holiday either fizzles out or the holiday has to come to an end and you have to get back to normality. I thought the holiday was normality. I thought that was how it was supposed to be.

Looking back I can see it so differently. He never had any money. He walked out of a job in January when there was hardly any work. He needed a van for a new job but couldn't afford it so my brother in law sold him one but I paid for it. He kept insisting that I get on and deal with the divorce and ask for half of everything. I didn't want to deal with it, I was ignoring it, hoping it would all go away, I had been to the doctors by this stage and they gave me AD's for depression and anxiety. I didn't want anything from the house. I didn't feel like I deserved it. My husband was finding it hard and was suffering badly. I had heard rumours that he was seeing the bunny boiler and realised that it was most likely for company, albeit a painful dig from the woman that stalked us for so many years and why her of all people? My husband did all he could to keep in contact with me but I wouldn't talk to him. I couldn't. How could I after what I'd done to him. I'd done the one thing I promised him I never would. He wanted to meet me outside work but I couldn't. It was too hard and painful. The thought of us hanging onto each other crying our eyes out was agony and I knew that's how it would be so I tried to ignore it and carry on in my own daydream/nightmare land. When I said that my husband was still trying to contact me at work, trying to tell me that this bloke is renowned for being a stealing, lieing, cheating waster, he insisted that I get the police onto him for harassment and for not leaving us alone. It was the last thing I wanted to do but it caused such an almighty row and he was so angry that I did. It wasn't a proud moment I can assure you.

All in all I had moved away for eight long months. Away from everyone I knew. From last year October, all through a cold winter and into May. I had lost all my friends, lost my marriage and devastated us both in turn. We were getting divorced and negotiating the sale from the house. I was heartbroken. But knew it was too late. Too much damage had been done. There was no way I thought either of us could ever possibly come back from something like this and so I just sort of got on with it. As painful as it was. My husband though, god bless that man, never gave up. He never once gave up on me and told me to go to hell, which he had every right to do. He fought for me every step of the way. He was being so careful not to push it. He was dealing with the solicitors when needed, still hoping a reconciliation would happen, he would write to me every week, sometimes ten pages long, telling me how much he still loved me, how much he missed me and that he would give me the family I always wanted. I wouldn't believe those letters for so many months. I thought they were just words, words that I'd heard time and time again from him once before but this time, he really did mean it. In may, I agreed to meet him. He asked to come to the office. He was having a bad day a needed to see me. Before hand, I would flatly refuse, but this time he didn't need to persuade me. I was missing him so much. I desperately wanted to see him also but, I was so ashamed for what I'd done and the mess I'd caused. We met up, we cried and we talked. Openly and honestly. We had nothing else to lose. I didn't want him to go when he left and that was the first time there was a gentle stir in the fog. He asked me to keep open the lines of communication and I agreed and thats what we done. We started to text and talk to each other during our bad days, somehow we got each other through it and bit by bit the fog got clearer and clearer. We arranged to meet up again, this time for a drink. I thought it would be nice for us to have a bar meal, it had seemed so long since we shared a meal together, so we did and it hurt while doing it but it also felt so right, which scared me a little, but I tried not to let my emotional fears get the better of me and I continued to carry on enjoying the evening. Afterwards we talked about the possibility of us trying to sort it out and to hopefully maybe save our marriage, with it being 3 weeks away from the absolute.  We were both scared. There was no doubt deep down, that was what we wanted, what scared us was, was it possible, after everything that had happened. We desperately hoped it was and that it wasn't too late afterall.

About a week later, I had my comeuppance for the emotional trauma I'd caused. My bank account was emptied over two nights and my old childhood sweetheart had gone awol, together with my money. Back to his former girlfriend funnily enough. He left me with alot of debt, he had a free holiday to thailand out of me, he took money off my family, he got me arrested for criminal damage when I found out where he had gone to, he slagged me off to the hilt, he took advantage of me when I was vulnerable and he very nearly almost certainly helped me destroy my marriage. Words cannot express how angry I feel about him, about myself and about the situation I put us in. My husband had every right to say, I told you so. But he never once said it. He was there for me. God knows I didn't deserve it, but when my life was spinning so out of control, he stepped in and he stopped it for me. He stopped it and made me remember what normality really felt like.

That was five months ago now. We are ok. We have a big big hill to climb and alot of rebuilding to do but all in all, we are ok, I hope. We have good days and sadly, we still have some very dark days. We have talked and talked about what happened, how it happened, why it happened, only for us to have the same conversation over and over again a week later. I guess this is normal? I look for self help on the internet to try and find answers but nothing really stands out. We have talked about counseling, we were due to have an appointment last week but on the day, he said he was feeling ok, having a good day and didn't think it was needed so I cancelled it. I think it could be worth a try but I read different opinions on it. Also the pain is crippling, when he cant get his head around the ghosts that plague him, my heart literally breaks in two for him. I wish I could take all the pain away for him and suffer it instead. I wish it had been he who left me rather than him having to deal with all the insecurity, although I promise him repeatedly, I'll never ever leave him again. And I mean that with all my heart. I honestly don't know how I got through it last time. I hurt just as bad as he did and I continue to suffer just like he does. I live with the guilt every day and will do till I die most probably. I hope one day it will eventually go away for us and leave us in peace to get on with our lives and our marriage and hopefully any children along the way as we are now also trying for a family! And I hope one day, I can make it up to my husband for what I did and I hope he can forgive me in return.

Thank you for reading... I was ready to die this morning. Another black dark day...but this has helped.

Any words of wisdom greatly appreciated. Thanks.

Hi,

I just want to say well done to you for what you have just written, my heart goes out to you because I know exactly the hurt and emotions you are going through.  I sincerely hope both you and your husband manage to fight your way through for both your sakes because I think in the long run, you will make it.  You will have both come out of this so much stronger people that you will appreciate each other all the more.  I really, really wish you well and I agree with you, having an affair is not worth the hurting it causes.

I had one two years ago, separated from my husband for the other man but he has now turned out not to be the wonderful person I thought he was.  You are quite right, its almost like having a holiday being with someone else because it is so different from the normality you are used to.  Having someone like you and find you attractive is so appealing and flattering to your ego but deep down, its nothing, nothing at all.  Just my ego being given a short term boost.

My husband (not divorced yet) has never said 'I told you so' either.  He has been a friend to me all this time even with another man in my life.  We have children so it was a blessing that it was this way but he didn't have to be.  He could have been nasty but he was even there for me when I was upset.  That truly is a man, just like your husband and we never even saw it! 

 My husband would like us to try again, I think, nothing has been said but it appears that way.  I am frightened though, how can he ever trust me again and I don't want things thrown back in my face.  I think we would be treading on eggshells all the time around each other and it would scare me so it looks like I may stay alone.  You are so, so brave to try and make things work between you.  

You will find a lot of people on here who can give you wonderful support, it helps so much to just write things down when you are having a bad day.

Take care x

Hello ally.

Thanks for taking the time in reading my epic post! It went on quite a bit, but as you probably know, nothing's that straight forward that you can spell it out in a couple of lines. If only life was that easy.

I so understand your emotion of fear. It's the most terrifying feeling isn't it. Not knowing what to do or how to do it incase you make another mistake. That was the worst thing for me and more than likely, the main reason why I kept away so long. My husband was practically on his knees, begging me to come back. But I couldn't. I was too scared. I was too scared to face him and face the hurt I'd caused.

I knew deep down that this other man wasn't the man for me. I was kidding myself, and I told myself that something good, no matter how small, had to come out of it, to somehow make all the mess worthwile. I was living in la la land... pretending and acting like we were still the teenagers we were back at school but living in the bodies of adults. After a while I started to realise or at least started to suspect, what a stupid stupid mistake I'd made. Then soon after that, the Oh My God, what have I done? syndrome kicked in. But even then I tried to blank it out of my mind, living in denial, convincing myself that my subconscious wasn't screaming at me, shouting, what the hell are you doing? 

It took a long time, a lot of hurt and alot of tears to get where we are now and I don't feel we've even started the climb yet. We're at the foothold of the mountain and we have a long way to go but at least we've made a start. If it wasn't for my husband's patience, perseverance and his promise to never give up on me, we wouldn't be here now. I have so much to be grateful for.  I was too ready to throw it away simply because I was too scared to cope with it. I told him about my fears and like you, I didn't want it rubbed in my face every day. He promised me he wouldn't do that and he hasn't but its not easy. I know there are times when he's almost bursting with frustration, hurt and anger, as if he's about to explode. Its scary and the emotions frighten me but I have to deal with it, with him, together.  Personally, I want to forget about it, never talk about it, pretend it didn't happen. But I cant do that. Thats simply being scared again and wanting to take the easy route. To make this work I have to have courage and face it and face the hurt it causes my husband.  It takes alot courage putting your hands up and admitting to everyone, including yourself, that you've messed up. 

I owe alot to my husband and will forever be grateful that he stood by my side, in good times and bad. I still get scared, but I know, with him being there to help me and for me to help him, where I can, we can somehow get through it.

I hope you can find peace in whichever you decide to do, I just know without my best friend, I wouldn't have been able to.

Take care too x.

Its a pity we can't turn back the clock, isn't it?  The mistakes we make stay with us for the rest of our lives, I just hope I learn by mine.  In fact I have.  Never, never again!

My relationship with the other man has recently ended so I'm still very emotional but I have been good and made sure there is no contact.  I just need time to get over it but I'm finding it hard because of the feelings I have for this other person.  Unfortunately, they are those that I should have for my husband which is worst.  I  know it wouldn't work between us but I still love and fancy him like mad!

Like I said, I think my husband would like us to try again, nothing has been said out loud but suggestions have been made on his part but I just can't do it.  I'm too scared and how can I hurt him again?  I care about him, but its not love and that other stupid emotion, lust, so I don't know what to do.  I agreed to go out on a couple of days out with my husband and the kids soon.  He invited me and I agreed but I'm not sure if I've done the wrong thing for both of us.

Ally2

Ohh..If I could have one wish, it would be just that..to turn the clock back.  God how I wish I could go back and change it. I wake up every day and deeply regret the mistakes I made. Hindsight is a wonderful thing isn't it.  

We went out last night to a gig in the hope of having an enjoyable night out but he couldn't rise to the occasion. He could hardly raise a smile, let alone anything else, and as for conversation, that was painful too. Just very stilted and very quiet. It didn't help that the gig had been moved to a week night and that to get to it, we had to drive 30 miles in the pouring rain but even so, normally he wouldn't have minded so much, it was his sort of music but still, he clearly had other things on his mind.

This morning there wasn't much improvement. Aswell as being broody and quiet he also leaps to being clingy and very needy, sometimes suffocatingly so. But I cant yell at him or get short tempered because of it, how's that going to help? Instead, I try to be as patient as I can and I try to be as soothing as I can. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. I've managed to persuade him to visit his doctor this morning. If he thinks counseling wouldn't help then maybe this will instead. He eventually phoned the surgery after my constantly asking him and he rang me to say he had made an appointment for 2 weeks time. I told him 2 weeks was no good. He needed to go as soon as possible.  It was better than nothing though so ok. At least he had made an appointment. After the phone call I then rang the doctors myself. I asked to speak to his doctor which I managed to do and I explained what was going on and how badly he seems to be suffering. By the end of the phone call, which lasted some 10 to 15 minutes, I managed to get him an appointment, with his doctor, for 4.30 this afternoon. I rang my husband told him there was a cancellation and that I thought it would be better for him to take that one, which he reluctantly agreed to do. I didn't tell him about the phone call I had with his doctor though. I just wanted to make the sure the doc was aware of the situation and that he tries to get my husband to talk openly, so that he can maybe start to get a little help.

Its all I can do for now, until he feels ready to move onto the next stage. Sometimes I wonder if we'll ever get to the next stage and that old feeling of fear creeps back in with avengence and the overall picture of the nightmare we're going through, is very scary. This is real tough grown-up stuff here, and at times I wonder if I have the strength to pull it together. I'm not only carrying myself, I'm carrying him too but I guess its the least I can do.

I guess if I didn't love him and only cared for him, I wouldn't perhaps be prepared for all the upheaval, but I know in my heart I love him truly. I admit, back to the beginning, before I left and during all our problems, I did fall out of love with him and thats something that I really really want to change and turn around. Its not going to happen overnight, I understand that but the fact that I want it to happen, helps me along my way with what I need to do to get there.  If you are completely, 100% certain that you do not love your husband anymore then I think its only fair that he know's that and he is left to move on with his life. Easier said than done, I know. But if there's a part of you, no matter how small or tiny that isn't really sure, then I would say that there is maybe a tiny glimmer of hope and who knows, given time, maybe there's room for it to grow again. I'd go on the day's out, have a nice time with your family and treat it for what it is, a nice day out with your loved ones. But go with an open mind, and a fresh attitude and who know's what could happen. You could make up your mind once and for all or, you could just surprise yourself.

Take care x.